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> Grid Tie Inverters Plugging In To A Wall Socket?
makourain2
Posted: August 22, 2010 11:36 am
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i have a wind turbine that i want to grid tie, at the moment iv just been using it to power lights in the house.
on ebay they sell grid tie inverters that u simply hook up to your batteries and then plug the inverter in to a wall socket with a male to male plug.
iv always been told to be wary of this kind of thing, and even if it were to work that if the power ever went down the inverter would try to power the rest of the street and if someone from the power company comes to do some repairs and gets electrocuted its my fault.

so, if i get one of these inverters and just plug it in to a wall socket, will it turn the meter backwards when no other appliance is being used?
and if i do this, is there a way to get a switch that will disconnect the inverter when the mains power goes down?
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MacFromOK
Posted: August 22, 2010 11:42 am
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I suggest you check the local power company's policy before trying to put any power back into the grid. I'm sure they will at least require a safety switch for the very reasons you mentioned, and they may even require a second meter (some will only pay wholesale prices for surplus power, while you still get charged retail). beer.gif


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CWB
Posted: August 22, 2010 02:13 pm
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absolutely ! you can create a life threatening situation for linemen and others .

all devices that have the potential (no pun intended) to generate power and be tied to the commercial lines and "back-feed" have to be approved by the engineering department of your local electric company .
upon installation they have to be certified for correct installation/operation .


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tekwiz
Posted: August 22, 2010 11:11 pm
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QUOTE (makourain2 @ August 22, 2010 02:36 am)
i have a wind turbine that i want to grid tie, at the moment iv just been using it to power lights in the house.
on ebay they sell grid tie inverters that u simply hook up to your batteries and then plug the inverter in to a wall socket with a male to male plug.
iv always been told to be wary of this kind of thing, and even if it were to work that if the power ever went down the inverter would try to power the rest of the street and if someone from the power company comes to do some repairs and gets electrocuted its my fault.

so, if i get one of these inverters and just plug it in to a wall socket, will it turn the meter backwards when no other appliance is being used?
and if i do this, is there a way to get a switch that will disconnect the inverter when the mains power goes down?

You are correct. IIRC, most synchronous inverters designed for grid tie are made to go down if mains power is lost. A quick check with the seller will confirm this.
Grid tie inverters are the state of the art for micro power generation setups. Many utilities & governments are actively promoting their use by offerring incentives toward their purchase & usage.


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Nothing40
Posted: August 23, 2010 02:06 am
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I think the term to plug into Google is "islanding".
If the power were to go out,and you wanted to power your house (or,at least part of it,depending on large the inverter is) you can turn off the big main breaker for your house,and isolate yourself from the grid. Then it would be safe to use. (although,whether that's an approved setup by your power co is another matter.)This will isolate your house from the rest of the neighborhood,so you don't end up trying to feed the rest of the block,and zapping any people working on the lines.


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CWB
Posted: August 23, 2010 02:12 am
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heh ...
can you imagine the ground crew , led by a guy that is 6'6" and weighs about 250 pounds , walking up to your house with a really pissed-off look in their eyes ?
a thought to keep in mind ... before and during the research , selection and installation of do-it-yerself grid-tie equipment .


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johansen
Posted: August 23, 2010 02:17 am
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i wouldn't have a problem spending a grand on a 2kw grid-tie inverter and hooking it up... provided the utility wouldn't shut my power off the moment the meter starts spinning backwards.
although most companies encourage RE, a lot of them now require that a separate meter measure your power generation, and they won't give you but whole sale rates for it.

If i were on an older analogue meter I would not have a problem using the grid as a "giant battery" without letting them know.

THE PROBLEM IS THAT YOUR EBAY GRID TIE INVERTER THAT PLUGS INTO A WALL OUTLET IS NOT UL OR CSA LISTED AND MIGHT BURN YOUR HOUSE DOWN AND VOID YOUR INSURANCE.


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makourain2
Posted: August 23, 2010 12:08 pm
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http://cgi.ebay.com/600W-GRID-TIE-INVERTER...owerAdaptors_SM

this is the one

this guy is from china and it always makes me wary when guys with really bad spelling tell me it will work and to "trust me"
and why wouldnt i be able to connect it to a battery?
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johansen
Posted: August 23, 2010 12:27 pm
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If I had 250$ to throw away I'd buy it, just to reverse engineer it and post the schematics, detailed plots of thd, noise, efficiency, etc

but consider this, the American made grid tie inverters are getting down to 50-70 cents a watt and have 10 to 20 year warranties. Same price but better _everything_ a lot of them can be paralleled, run as a stand alone inverter, efficiency is often better than 95%, etc. etc.

why is this one sold as 90-130 volt, same wattage but half the price of the other?
http://cgi.ebay.com/600W-GRID-TIE-INVERTER...709820496864071


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CWB
Posted: August 23, 2010 03:14 pm
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laugh.gif laugh.gif

yeah man ... same thing , different price .

the specs say there is 2% distortion ... i imagine that this is a half truth .


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tekwiz
Posted: August 23, 2010 05:26 pm
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QUOTE (johansen @ August 23, 2010 03:27 am)


but consider this, the American made grid tie inverters are getting down to 50-70 cents a watt and have 10 to 20 year warranties. Same price but better _everything_  a lot of them can be paralleled, run as a stand alone inverter, efficiency is often better than 95%, etc. etc.


And I'll bet that virtually every one is actually made in China. laugh.gif

@CWB: Yeah, 2% distortion when you have the entire national grid connected to help smooth things out. tongue.gif


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Trouble rather the tiger in his lair, than the sage among his books.
For to you, kings & armies are things mighty & enduring.
To him, mere toys of the moment, to be overturned at the flick of a finger.

Fortuna favet fortibus.
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